Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: Is the difference between the life you have and the life you want. Just one decision you've been avoiding,
[00:00:07] Speaker B: ramping up your business.
[00:00:09] Speaker A: The time is near.
[00:00:10] Speaker C: You've given it hard.
[00:00:12] Speaker A: Now get it in gear. It's Passage to Profit with Richard and Elizabeth Gearhart. I'm Richard Gearhart.
[00:00:19] Speaker D: I'm Elizabeth Gearhart and we're your host.
[00:00:22] Speaker A: Welcome to the Passage to Profit show, the Road to Entrepreneurship podcast. We're with Matt Ross, who is the founder of the One River School and he's also the former CEO of the School of Rock. He's also an author and a commentator as well. So welcome to the show, Matt.
[00:00:39] Speaker C: Thank you.
[00:00:40] Speaker A: And in addition, we have ken Dashow from Q104. Three, the Rock of New York.
[00:00:47] Speaker E: Not that guy again.
[00:00:48] Speaker A: Ken is just the rock of New York radio. He's absolutely amazing. He was the one who introduced us to Matt and they go way back. And, and so we invited him to be on the show to maybe expose a few of Matt's skeletons during this interview.
[00:01:03] Speaker D: And as if that's not enough, Eleanor Kubacki is the founder and CEO of EFK Group. All I have to say is go to her website. You've never seen a website like this before in your life. Talk about cutting edge marketing. Wow, we gotta hear from her. And then Antonia Tamayo, who we dearly love with Antonia's promise, who has made huge strides in her business in just the last couple of months. We just really want to catch up with her.
[00:01:27] Speaker A: So you may know that you can clone yourself with AI, but can you control it? We'll talk about that later. But first, it's time for your new business journey. We'd like to ask our panel, when you look back, what was the one decision or moment that changed the trajectory of your business and what did it cost you to make that decision? Welcome to the show, Matt. Good to have you here.
What was the one decision that you made that changed the trajectory of your business?
[00:01:52] Speaker C: I love that question. So as we were building One River School, I mentioned earlier, we opened one in Englewood, September 2012. I'm going to actually kind of break it down into three moments, but it's kind of part, part and parcel of the same logic. I said I was going to prove concept with the first school and not open any more if I couldn't do it. Well, we got that first one done and then we opened.
[00:02:16] Speaker E: We.
[00:02:16] Speaker C: We went from one to 15 in three years and then Covid.
So the one decision that I made was when we went into that Covid Window, don't run out of cash, jump all in with full body, stabilize the business, but to use this window of time, where we theoretically couldn't open a whole lot more schools, to dramatically improve how we did every aspect of our business.
So while that was a very strange time for everyone, we use that Covid window and the two years thereafter to refine every operational component of our business. So now we're prepared to scale. We're starting to franchise. We've built cash, resources and reserves, and we're in a better place than we've ever been. So sometimes people get that bug to grow, grow, grow.
Sometimes, no, you want to get to a certain trajectory, pause and refine, refine and learn and learn before you push play on that hockey stick. Growth.
[00:03:18] Speaker A: Perfect. Thank you. Eleanor Kubaki, welcome to the show. What was the one decision that you made that changed the trajectory of your business?
[00:03:26] Speaker F: For me, it's a mentality of always looking at things from a positive perspective and saying, yes. I got a phone call. It was about 15 years ago, and you guys probably remember Prince tennis, And we got a call from them to do their packaging, and they gave us a really low ball number to design their packaging. And we sat, and I remember being in my office and thinking, oh, my gosh, that is just so below market value. And I said, but you know what? My daughter's playing tennis, and this is the premier tennis brand. I said, yes. And for me, that led us to doing the global rebrand within that year, we got to do a global rebound rebrand for Prince Sports. And for me, I've always taken those opportunities. And sometimes you feel a little pressure because, you know, during, you know, different times of growth, sometimes it's hard to take those opportunities where you know for a fact you will lose money. But I have found that almost always when I'm so committed and passionate about whether it's a brand, a service, a person that if I believe in it, it doesn't really matter what the dollar amount is. It's really about what you can build together and taking those sh. I'm always one to take those shots. If someone has an idea, come bring it to me, because I love ideas, and I love branding them and bringing them to market. So for me, that was a really big turning point for me. To see your something that you create as an agency all throughout the world, it was really beautiful. So that, for me, was a big one.
[00:04:59] Speaker A: Yeah, that sounds huge. And sometimes playing the long game can make a difference, right?
You know, if. Especially if they understand, well, this is like a one time thing. This is a get to know you kind of project and doing a little favor for them and sometimes, you know, take you to bigger and better things.
[00:05:16] Speaker F: Absolutely.
[00:05:17] Speaker A: Antonio Tamayo, what's the one decision that you made that changed the trajectory of your business?
[00:05:23] Speaker G: Back In January of 2024, I was invited to PodFest by yourself and your wife. And I was introduced to the idea of having my own podcast. And you know, I was like, me, out of all people. And you guys were like, yeah. And I started my own podcast and I absolutely love it. And it's opened so many tremendous doors for me. I get emotional because every time I come here, it's like the first time for me and I never take it for granted. And a lot of the things that you said today, the both of you resonate with me, right, because it speaks truth about being a true entrepreneur. But for me, having my own podcast, not only have I met amazing people, but I love radio and I always have. But it's changed so much and it's what helped me launch my jewelry line.
That's what did it. And that was a big turning point for me.
[00:06:21] Speaker A: You're a natural, Antonia.
[00:06:23] Speaker E: You are.
[00:06:24] Speaker A: So you belong on the airwaves for sure. Elizabeth.
[00:06:28] Speaker D: Well, it was actually kind of a combination of something that you and I did together before COVID Can we talk about this? Yes, we can talk about this. So I know Matt made me think about this. This isn't even going to be my answer day. But before COVID Richard and I were coming into the Iheart studios every single week and recording our show at iheart every single week.
And then when Covid hit, we were like, well, we don't want to give that up.
So we had a conference room with a couple mics. It wasn't very good.
So Noah was like, what am I supposed to do with this? Like, this sound is terrible. I don't know why I want to put this on the radio. But Richard went out and figured it out and bought. Well, he didn't go out. He ordered from Amazon, bought like super good high quality sound equipment and cameras. And we set up a studio in one of the many unused rooms in the law firm during COVID right.
And started recording the podcast on Zoom, but. But with super high quality equipment. And that really was a change because now we do do some of these. We use Riverside now we do some episodes on Riverside. So we get people from LA who are really high powered, who don't want to make the trip into New York right now. And from all over the country. Yeah. But we switched and Covid forced to switch from just in person to sometimes in person, sometimes on zoom, and that really has made a huge difference.
[00:07:50] Speaker A: Well, thank you for that. For myself, one of the things that's been lately changing the trajectory of our business, Gerhart Law, specializing in intellectual property, patents, trademarks, and copyrights, was we hired a new management team.
So before I was managing the law firm, and I'm a lawyer, I'm not really a manager, so we got some people in who are fractional CEO in, and a fractional CFO and a fractional coo. And Elizabeth's always been the cmo. And so that's the sort of a interim chief executive officer, a financial officer, operations person.
And they've really started to change things, and they're doing stuff that I used to have to do, and that frees up time for me to screw around and surf the Internet. No, I go out and develop business and think strategically and all those kinds of things.
[00:08:42] Speaker D: And you've been doing it for 20 years? Almost.
[00:08:45] Speaker A: I have.
[00:08:45] Speaker D: In a couple months, it'll be 20 years.
[00:08:47] Speaker A: 20 years, yeah. It's time for a break, isn't it?
[00:08:50] Speaker D: Time for a party.
[00:08:52] Speaker A: Time to screw around a little bit. Anyway, so that's it for your new business journey. Now it's time for our featured guest, Matt Ross, who is the founder of the One River School, and he's also the former CEO of the School of Rock. He's also an author and a commentator as well. So welcome to the show, Matt.
[00:09:11] Speaker C: Thank you.
[00:09:12] Speaker A: Very nice to have you here. You were the CEO of School of Rock. So the most important question we all want to know is, did you ever meet Jack Black?
[00:09:21] Speaker C: No, but I met. I met his alter ego, a guy named Paul Green. And actually, Paul Green was the human that that character was based on, and he was the founder of School of Rock.
[00:09:32] Speaker A: No kidding. So how did you get involved with School of Rock?
[00:09:35] Speaker C: Great question. So I was in radio at the time, trying to figure an exit plan out of radio. Why not? Because I hate radio. Because I did it 20 years, and I sort of needed to try something different. Different? I was managing musicians, and an artist that I was managing texted me one day and said, how'd you like to be the CEO of School of Rock? And I thought my career was over because I'm getting job leads from my struggling musician who I thought was teaching in someone's living room. As it turned out, they had five schools, they were out of money, and they needed a Leader to help stabilize the business and scale it. And it was right for me.
[00:10:10] Speaker D: How many schools do they have now?
[00:10:11] Speaker C: 400.
[00:10:12] Speaker D: I guess that you were the right guy.
[00:10:14] Speaker A: There's a lot of rocking going on out there.
[00:10:16] Speaker C: Yeah, we, we in. And you know, like most companies, growth occurs in phases.
My phase was the stabilize, raise capital, build credibility and really begin to scale to proof concept. So we got it from 5 to 55 in three years. We had another 50 under contract. And then the recession hit in 2009. You pause, you push pause, stabilize again, raise new capital.
And I left in 2010.
[00:10:43] Speaker G: Wow.
[00:10:43] Speaker C: So I did, I did what I was supposed to do with that brand.
[00:10:47] Speaker A: It's a great business model. First of all, you've got this killer movie leading the way, Right. And then every kid wants to be a rock star, right? For sure. Ken Dashow from Q 104.3, the Rock of New York. Ken, did you want to be a rock star?
[00:11:01] Speaker E: You know, it's weird. I love musicians and I play, but as a little kid on the radio, hearing that happy voice play the Beatles for me, for whatever reason, I always thought I would love to do that. I would love to be that person in your ear, making your day better. It just made me happy listening to the radio. And that was the AM days. So I was the guy spitting all the plates like a plague act. I was writing plays. I was built a high school radio station. I was doing comedy, I was doing stand up, I was writing plays, I was acting, I was doing everything and loved it all. But it's scrambling and radio just seemed like the door opened wider there. 17 years at the station. I grew up listening to WNEW fm. And when that collapsed, this other station, that had been the classical station In New York, Q104.3, it was WQXR. Classical said maybe rock isn't finished. And they kind of cherry picked their favorite DJs. And Matt Ross was the GM at the time who said to programming, I want Kenny to do afternoons. I hear what it's supposed to sound like.
[00:12:05] Speaker C: It's true.
[00:12:06] Speaker E: You always have to have an angel. You have to have somebody who is your cheerleader who takes that chance on you. And like anything, it's especially true in acting and in the arts. But I think in any business, when somebody gives you the opportunity, that's the luck. But you have to have the skill set to deliver. He paid me $10,000, but that's in $10 installments.
[00:12:29] Speaker A: Well, when we were talking before the show, you said that you had to go approach the program director with this suggestion. And back in those days, program directors were king. They really didn't take suggestions from the gm. Right?
[00:12:44] Speaker C: Yeah. If you're the GM of a baseball team, you're not sending messages to the manager on the field. They want to manage their players and put them in the positions that they see fit. And so the program department, they don't want the gm, who's typically the business guy or Galaxy, telling them who to put on the air and when. But our guy, Bob Buckman, was new to us from Long Island. He was at bab. He was trying to work with me to build the brand. He was really open and flexible and different, and he saw the same thing in Kenny.
[00:13:12] Speaker D: So did you guys know each other, Kenny and I? Yeah.
[00:13:14] Speaker C: No, no, no.
[00:13:16] Speaker E: We met at work. You know, at work as my boss. And we've been lifelong friends because we. We kind of see life the same way, as a series of opportunities and doing your best, you know. Why have I had this luck? April 1st, it'll be 28 years on the air here at Q104.3, which in radio years is like a thousand. But I understand that my job is to be entertaining and be on the air. But the other part of my job is to help the salespeople sell what I do. And there are. There are artists and there are DJs who. I don't want to know anything about that. Don't talk to me.
Which I don't know. I don't think it works if you're living on an island. Do I go on sales calls? Do I make videos every single week? Because if they can't sell it, it doesn't matter what I do.
[00:14:03] Speaker A: I mean, there's the art side and there's the business side. Right. And both have to be there for the art to be heard. Right.
[00:14:09] Speaker E: One of the things in School of Rock, and I don't know, I mean, they're teaching them how to play, and it's wonderful. But it's called the music business. It's called show business.
And as talented as you want to be, the other part of the word is very, very important.
[00:14:23] Speaker A: Absolutely. And so that's what you're doing now with One River School. Right. It's a school for creative education, and it's one of the only private schools that does that.
[00:14:33] Speaker C: Yeah. So I left School of rock. It was 2010, had a lot going on personally, and now I had this gap professionally. I wrote a book about this recently. It came out called Grow or Fold. And it was for me, a pivot point to make a bet on myself.
And the idea here was, how come there were no cool art schools in my neighborhood. I didn't know that I'd open a lot of them, but I just thought I would do one in Englewood, New Jersey, One river from New York, take some of that city culture and bring it to the burbs and see if I could translate what we did from School of Rock into art and design education. And it worked. We have 15 now and going to scale it.
[00:15:10] Speaker D: So what are the age of the people that are in your school?
[00:15:12] Speaker C: One river in terms of students, all ages. We started pre K and we go to senior citizens.
[00:15:18] Speaker A: Sign me up. I'm in the latter category now.
[00:15:20] Speaker D: What kind of projects do you do?
[00:15:22] Speaker C: So we wrote our own curriculum. And so if you sign up, you don't take like that semester class in charcoal drawing. You jump in and you take a class called Art Shuffle, which means it's project based. And every month, new project. We changed the medium, we changed the subject matter, the reference artist, so it doesn't get dull and stale and boring. Or you could take a focus class, focus on painting or drawing, and we could take you into one medium. We have digital art classes, animation, all sorts of things, pre college programs, summer camps. So there really is a broad menu of class types that we've created with our own lesson plans that we wrote ourselves. So from an IP standpoint, we own all of this intellectual property. It's unique to us and it's.
[00:16:08] Speaker A: I'm proud of it, very valuable.
[00:16:10] Speaker E: One of the things I was going to say about Matt's book that I love about Grow or Fold, it's not just a rah rah book. It's not, hey, you can do this. If you want to make a change midlife and get out of the corporate world and start your own business, you can do it. It's a workbook that goes through the steps of what you have to think about your personal.
Are you risk averse? How much risk are you willing to take if you want to start a business and you're passionate, do you do your research?
And the thing I love the most, Matt, about your book is that at the end it says, do this workbook. It's an actual workbook. Answer these questions and in the end you may find out this is absolutely not right for me. You know, it's not just telling you you can do it. It's saying if you want to look this through, and that is the most helpful thing I Can think of if somebody wants to try it, not just say, go for it, dude.
[00:16:58] Speaker C: You know, when I was young, we didn't put the 25 year old entrepreneur, you know, on a pedestal.
Kind of didn't exist.
[00:17:07] Speaker A: Like right now, if you're not wearing a hoodie, you can't be an entrepreneur. Right.
[00:17:12] Speaker C: The folks who changed it were really like, oh, Ken's got his hoodie's got his hoodie.
[00:17:16] Speaker E: I got a new AI system coming in.
[00:17:18] Speaker C: If you think about it, Microsoft and Apple had a lot to do with changing that culture, as did Google. Google and stuff. Because there was this premium for coders and young folks who grew up with that, we didn't grow up with it. And that whole ecosystem grew up. But from my perspective being an entrepreneur at 50, which was when I launched One River, I was kind of now really, really well prepared and I could take the risk economically and I was betting on myself because I had to. Meaning I, I wasn't gonna work for anyone else at that point.
[00:17:52] Speaker A: So do you ever run across entrepreneurs who make that leap and it doesn't go quite as quickly as they would like and then they sort of now start drifting into other things and do you have advice for them? I mean, how to. Cause maybe you try something and it doesn't land right away.
What are kind of like some of the next steps you would.
[00:18:15] Speaker C: Yeah, it's a complex question. Cause I think everyone has their own case study, right? Are they drifting because their product fit is not right? Are they drifting because they are not doing it well? Are they drifting because they have bills and pressure and this is not yielding the cash flow that they needed to make their ends meet? You know, so I think it's, you know, generally speaking it's about cash first. First and foremost, you need three and four times what you think you need. And if you're going to be successful in entrepreneurship, because nobody's a straight line to success, it always takes double or triple longer and double or triple the dough.
So the only way you can fight through that is have to have some sponsorship, maybe have some other side money coming in. When I launched One River, I actually had two consulting projects and I did that to keep cash coming in the door, take a little pressure off me, extend the time it took to be successful. Because we also have these artificial goals. Like it's too. It's never as fast as you think it's going to be.
[00:19:23] Speaker A: Ken, what are your. Sound familiar?
[00:19:24] Speaker G: Oh yeah.
[00:19:25] Speaker E: You know, in trying to get plays and things done, I'm helping a Friend now trying to bring a successful winning play in England, bringing it to America, won the BAFTAs there. And I said, you think it'll be up next fall? He said, no, maybe by 29.
And I realized that the timeline of building a show to get to Broadway or even off Broadway, after you put putting a down payment on this theater, if and when it comes up, rehearsals, casting, you have the lead, but you didn't get the theater. Well, the lead fell through because he got a movie. That the timeline that you think that you want to have happen in your head, like building a house from scratch. And when those people say we'll be in by Christmas, not this Christmas, maybe two years.
But it's, you know, to me, the thing I take away from Matt's book and I think for any business, for any of us is that if it's assume it's not going to happen on the timeline that you would like.
And again, how are you going to keep it going in the interim? If it's a good idea, it'll catch on.
[00:20:29] Speaker C: I want to add one more point to that also.
What's happening in your personal life.
So if you've got a really good, stable personal life and if you've got good support from a spouse or partner, it makes it infinitely easier if you don't have critical challenges outside of, you know, your household, like parents and kids with struggles. And I had all of that, you know, but at 50, had pretty solid skill set.
So for me, I didn't worry about being successful. I just knew I had to do it and I would learn the space, the art education space over time, hire experts in that space and facilitate. And I look at like people who run businesses. The probably facilitation is the thing you do the most because you need to do what you do best and get a whole bunch of other people who do all these other things better than you if you're going to be successful.
[00:21:21] Speaker A: I'm just sitting here running my own list of things.
[00:21:25] Speaker D: I wanted to make a comment about Ken because it's really interesting. You don't just sit back and play records all day. On your slot on Q 104.3, the Rock of New York, you have the three at three. I love the three at three.
[00:21:38] Speaker E: Oh, thank you.
[00:21:39] Speaker D: I didn't get to catch it yesterday if nobody's heard it. At three o' clock he plays three songs that have to do with something going on in the news. And it might just be like one word from each song or something.
And then you have people call in and try to guess right.
[00:21:52] Speaker E: Yeah. And the reason I built that. And again, it's fun to do, but I built it with a purpose of what can we do for a workday that can orient people?
We call that sort of appointment. Listening is the phrase we use in radio. And my favorite is, hey, Ken, you know, that's our coffee break. We all stop in the office at 3 o' clock and we all try to guess. There's a plumber who says, I always say, oh, I left a tool I need and I go out to my truck at three to do it because that's their break in the day. I do a live song at five o'. Clock. We call it Live at five. It's not that complicated, but people use it as a tool. Ken, if I'm not on the George Washington Bridge by the time you do Live at five, I'm screwed. I'm not going to get home in time for dinner. And that's what radio can do at its best. And you keep it fun, but you take the concept of what will be of great value to the audience, will be entertaining, but also will help us with listenership that then sales can go out and have it sponsored.
[00:22:49] Speaker D: So you took a medium where people thought they knew everything and had done everything already, and you created something brand new in it. And I think you create a community around that because people are calling you all the time.
[00:23:00] Speaker E: Yeah, look, we started this thing called Breakfast with the Beatles.
And you know, this goes back 24, five years.
And I had said to our program director, it's the anniversary of them coming to America, what if I this Sunday morning, as I did a Sunday morning show too, I said, what if I played some Beatles? And Bob said, play all Beatles. Like, like two hours of Beatles. Like, yeah, play all Beatles. So I did it. And I came in Monday and he said, did you play all Beatles? I thought you told me to. I thought it was me. He said, we have never gotten so many emails, so many requests. They said, when are you going to do it again? I said, I'll do it next year. And here's brilliance. When he said, how about next week? And I said, really? He said, why not? And I did it next week. And it's been 25 years now. And the thing is, if you take a chance and it works, you know, don't look past that.
[00:23:52] Speaker C: I want to add a thought there because nowadays everything, so much of your success is all also tied to how well you manage your website and the user experience online. And we've all Heard maybe we haven't about a B testing, you know, so in effect, that was just a test. It was. They tested something and it was a, we're going to try this or we're going to be. We're going to continue to do it the old way that we were doing it and now it worked. So they jumped into that pathway. And I think entrepreneurship requires that all the time.
If you're not testing, measuring, resetting, iterating, testing again, you can't get to a different place.
[00:24:34] Speaker E: Is that how you did it with School of Rock?
[00:24:36] Speaker C: Yeah. I think almost every business that I've run over my career, there's always been tests. But nowadays what's different, Kenny, is all of the data sets that you get through online traffic, through people responding, through you getting emails, through you getting inquiries. So it requires the analytics. Because we would do so much by gut. Yeah, you know, we didn't have the analytics. Bob's gut was.
[00:25:04] Speaker F: Hey.
[00:25:04] Speaker C: And it wasn't gut. There was a data point. The phones rang off the hook. That's a data point. Nowadays it would be how long a duration were the calls, how many, which hours did they come in, how many, you know, how many went to the website.
[00:25:16] Speaker A: And the other thing, too is there's not the stigma associated with failure. Now you're supposed to fail, right. When I was a kid growing up, if you failed, that was a black mark against you. But now the culture has changed, so it's okay to make a mistake and correct course.
[00:25:31] Speaker C: And it's testing. Trials is another term we use.
And, you know, like when Nike comes out with new sneaker style, you know, they may not produce 7 million copies of that one. They may test it in a market, in a few stores, get a little feedback, change the design. Again, people don't know that, but it's kind of how products evolve over time.
[00:25:56] Speaker D: Richard's been doing a deep dive into our YouTube videos.
[00:25:59] Speaker E: And you can watch.
[00:26:00] Speaker A: Oh, my God, talk about analytical data.
You can watch the places where they drop off, for sure.
[00:26:05] Speaker D: Look, Elizabeth, you start talking, they all laugh.
[00:26:09] Speaker A: I don't think I've been that frank.
[00:26:11] Speaker C: You also get paralyzed with too much information.
[00:26:14] Speaker D: You can. It sometimes is too much.
[00:26:16] Speaker A: So you talk a little bit about, in your book about dysfunctional safety zone. What is that? And since we're sort of on this topic of trial and error.
[00:26:24] Speaker C: Okay, we're going to do a fun experiment right now. I want all of you to tell me the five or six things that frustrate you the most about your life that you're just stuck on right now. Go. I'm kidding.
[00:26:37] Speaker A: Okay. It's only an hour long show.
[00:26:42] Speaker C: How often do you, you sit with people and they go from A to B to C to D and all these things and then you sit with them.
[00:26:48] Speaker A: Isn't that what your spouse is for though? I mean, and you sit and you
[00:26:53] Speaker C: go through all these ideas that you, because you want to help them, you, the empathy in you. They're a friend, they're, you know, a soulmate.
And then they tell you every reason why they can't do any of them.
[00:27:05] Speaker D: Yes.
[00:27:06] Speaker C: So in some way this dysfunctional safe zone is we stay where we are in life because making change seems scarier, even though what you just told me is a pathway to probably more decline over time if you don't make it. People have to completely like fall hard sometimes to make change happen because then it's like they've got nothing to lose. My premise is very simply that this dysfunctional safe zone is, is a moment for us to reflect our own self awareness.
I have been where I am now for the last two years complaining about the same things.
Why haven't I changed any of them? Why haven't I improved any of them? Is it because I don't know what it is, how to do it, need the help, need the impetus? I'm scared.
So we wind up staying where we are and you have one life to live.
[00:27:59] Speaker A: I think it's about the illusion of safety. There is no illusion of safety.
[00:28:05] Speaker C: It's the illusion of safety. But like if you have something like we'll call it a bubbling up medical issue and you don't go do the testing, that bubbling up medical issue gets worse. There's no safety because your blood pressure's off the chart and you haven't gone for the proper tests. And that's just one example. It could be personal health, professional, you name it.
So I just think there's something about human nature where I didn't, I don't have this. I've always been attacking myself to a fault and it's part of the resilience, entrepreneurship. But I came live my whole life in a dysfunctional world that I had to self navigate. So it built some muscles to quickly diagnose broken stuff and push through it sometimes pushed too fast, too hard. So I had the opposite piece.
[00:28:56] Speaker D: So does your book help people do
[00:28:57] Speaker C: it does it does. So I work through a, a program where you can actually diagnose first, you know, self awareness. Where are you at? What's the current state? It's strategy, like we do in business. The concept is to treat yourself like a business.
[00:29:13] Speaker D: So what is the name of your book?
[00:29:14] Speaker C: Grow or Fold? Transform Yourself in Midlife and Beyond Can.
[00:29:18] Speaker D: Is it on Amazon?
[00:29:19] Speaker C: It's on Amazon. It's on every bookstore.
[00:29:22] Speaker A: We're here with Matt Ross, who's the founder of the One River School and former CEO of School of Rock, along with Ken Dashow from Q104.3, the Rock of New York. I mean, it's been absolutely amazing. A couple more questions for you. Talk about rediscovering creativity and passion. That's something both of you, I think, can speak to.
[00:29:41] Speaker E: Ken, the one question people always say you're playing the same songs all these years, how do you still stay so passionate about it? Because as an actor, as a performer, I still remember the excitement of hearing it for the first time. I remember hearing buying this album. I remember this. I remember that passion for it. And how do you do eight shows a week on Broadway, that matinee on Wednesday, that is just a killer for every performer in the crew. But the people in the audience, that's the first time they're seeing it. You know, a ball player. How do you get out on that field when it's the last thing you feel like doing today? And you're. Your wife's going through a thing and you re. We all have that, whether you're a star or just, you know, driving a bus, whatever. But if you can get up and do it and do your best, and that's what I try to bring. Whatever's going on in my head, I've always known since I was a kid, you leave that outside the studio door. When I walk in. When I walk in. It's not about sharing my problems. The only time I would talk about something in my personal life is this. If it's a funny story and some crazy thing happened to me, and that's a shared experience with the audience, but otherwise, I'm there to make your day a little bit better. And that's how I always looked at it, is that if this music and I can say something or say something interesting or fun, I did my two bits for the day.
[00:31:00] Speaker D: You are pretty funny sometimes.
[00:31:01] Speaker A: You are pretty funny. But if you're working with your passion, I know this is overstated, but if you're working with your passion, it's an easier place to go back to because you're passionate about what you're doing, you're passionate about your audience, and you're passionate about your music. And so that gives you the fuel to get to the next phase where you can put all the other stuff because it's a lower priority.
[00:31:25] Speaker E: At least, Richard, 100% right now I'm in my 60s and get together every year with some old friends and the discussion's always, when are you going to retire? And friends are like, two years, three months. I got seven weeks. And they say to me, you ever think about retiring? Like, yeah, that's why I wake up in a cold sweat in the middle of the night. And that's what I say to all the young people here at iHeart in New York.
That thing, that's your passion, that video you want to work on. You don't care if you sleep till 4 in the morning, do that.
And when you're 20 or 21, it's easier to do. When you're 55, it's harder. But that was my takeaway from Matt's book, Grow or Fold. If you have this passion and you see it could work, you just visualize how it could work. But you don't know how to get there.
[00:32:08] Speaker A: I mean, you have to get money to pay your bills. I understand that. But would you do it anyway? Or at least a little bit anyway, because you like what you're doing?
[00:32:19] Speaker E: So for me, 100%, I would as
[00:32:21] Speaker C: well, at this stage of my life, obviously.
[00:32:23] Speaker E: 100%, yeah. There's a joy to it every day. Speaking of which, I have to go do that.
[00:32:28] Speaker D: Ken has a show.
[00:32:29] Speaker A: Ken has a real show.
[00:32:31] Speaker E: Hey, don't put yourself down.
[00:32:33] Speaker A: This is a real show.
[00:32:34] Speaker D: So that was ken Dashow of Q 104.3, the Rock of New York. So I was talking to somebody who's at loose ends. She left her job, she's in her early 60s, and she's casting about. And I said to her, what is the one thing? Like, what is your day like? What's the one thing you really want to do when you get up in the morning? She couldn't think of anything. I'm hoping that she can't, because I tell her I'm doing research. Like, as soon as I get up, my first cup of tea, like, I'm doing research and I have to exercise. But I just. I'm really driven.
What are you driven to do? And is that something you cover in your book?
[00:33:08] Speaker C: It's kind of a challenge because everyone has their own sort of personality traits and makeup. Like you. I'm quite driven. I probably have a to do list that's way too long.
And so for me, it's about prioritizing and spending my time in the right way, doing the right things for the right amount of time. Other folks, man, you know, they hit different stages of life where they get discouraged. They may need a consultant or a coach, somebody to get them over the hump to crystallize the strategy.
So I've used this tool, the Gallup sort of Clifton strengths finder, for years. I recommend everyone look into it. There's four boxes. Relationship, strategy, execution, and influence. I'm very high on strategy and people relationship. But if you're really high on execution but you need help on strategy, the plan, then get somebody to help you. The problem is people don't ask for help. We all have this sort of thing.
I don't want to present that vulnerability. I don't want to tell people that I'm lost.
So I go down undercover and fake it, you know, And I think that's the problem. You got to raise your hand if you need a plan and you need the help. My book gives you tools to do it. You still may need somebody to help you.
[00:34:26] Speaker D: I think everybody needs a coach. Yep, I have a coach.
[00:34:29] Speaker C: I agree completely.
[00:34:29] Speaker D: Yeah.
[00:34:30] Speaker A: We're with Matt Ross, who is the founder of the One River School and he's also the former CEO of the School of Rock. Hey, if this conversation is firing you up, imagine getting this kind of insight every single day. Subscribe to our podcast and leave us a quick review. Follow Passage to profit on Instagram, Facebook, TikTok and X and subscribe to our YouTube channel for bonus content. This is how more entrepreneurs find us. So share it, post it, and tag it. Let's build this community together. Passage Prophet with Richard and Elizabeth Gerhart will be back after this commercial break.
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[00:37:06] Speaker A: Now back to passage to profit once again. Richard and Elizabeth Gearhart.
[00:37:11] Speaker D: Now it is time for Live AI Use Cases Business Owners Roundtable. So everybody gets a chance to say one way they're using AI and then we all get to have a discussion about it because it's so important and changing our society so much right now. So I am going to start with Matt Ross of OneRiverschool.com Matt, what is one way you're using AI?
[00:37:34] Speaker C: So right now we're building a whole new technology suite to support our business and we're building an AI service tool that helps improve the member experience.
What it does is that when people need a quick question answered as opposed to them calling our school, going to voicemail, et cetera, it will activate a sort of service tab that will answer most of the readily accessible questions.
So the customer experience gets better because they don't have to wait for an email to come back to them or a phone call to get return.
And so it just simplifies the member experience on basic customer service questions.
[00:38:18] Speaker D: That is a great way. So Eleanor Kubaki with efkgroup.com what is one way you're using AI?
[00:38:27] Speaker F: For us it is less about one way and every which way but look loose.
[00:38:32] Speaker D: What's your favorite way? Pick one. We'll talk about the rest of them after.
[00:38:36] Speaker F: Okay, so my favorite one for me Is now. Right now is we are adapting to AI agents for all of our staff. And for me, that's really exciting, the possibilities and, you know, depending upon what someone does at the agency, how and when to use AI agents. So for me, that's very, very much fun.
[00:38:57] Speaker D: That's the next phase. That's a big one.
[00:38:59] Speaker F: Yes.
[00:39:00] Speaker D: So, Antonia Tameya with antoniaspromise.com what is one way I see you laughing over there. What is one way you're using AI right now?
[00:39:08] Speaker G: Honestly, to learn. I mean, I ask it so many questions. I learn from it so much. I'm using it to market, I'm using it to brand myself, I'm using it to learn. I just had to fill out this tax certification. I'm like, I don't need an accountant. I'll do it myself.
Renewed my real estate license on it, like I had.
[00:39:27] Speaker D: That was about 20.
[00:39:30] Speaker G: There's nothing it can't do.
[00:39:33] Speaker F: It teaches me everything.
[00:39:34] Speaker D: We'll come back to you.
So, Richard Gearhart with gearhartlaw.com what's like your favorite way right now, or what did you do this morning with it?
[00:39:42] Speaker A: Well, I didn't really do too much with it this morning, but I did a lot with it over the week. We're in the process of trying to acquire another intellectual property practice, and it's a very complicated process because they're using different systems, working out the commission structures for the attorneys, trying to figure out how it's all going to work. And AI has just been amazing and has come up with a lot of ideas and solutions to problems that I couldn't really think through myself. And so far, the responses have made sense. Right. So you always worry, well, am I getting bad advice here? But the fact is, is that it's been pretty good on this topic. I think it does well when you have a very limited scope of information.
[00:40:26] Speaker D: So for me, Elizabeth Gearhart with Gear Media Studios, I put together a website for this particular podcast and I had Google Gemini lead me through every step of the way, but there were things wrong with it. So then I let it sit and vegetate, you know, because all the changes have to go through. And then I went to ChatGPT and I said, what's wrong with this website? Well, there's a whole bunch of stuff wrong with it. So Now I'm using ChatGPT to fix all the stuff on the website so that it'll come up higher in the results for Google. So, you know, we've said this so many times, you can't just Use one of these things. You got to use a bunch of them. But I would like to open this up. Like, who thinks that they love using it or has a really creative way. Okay, Antonia, I see, I see you back there.
[00:41:08] Speaker G: I love AI. I love it so much. And you had mentioned working on your website, so someone did help me create my new website, which I love.
But I also taught myself with ChatGPT, how to now put in SEO so that people can find me on Google. And I spent like 48 to 72 hours going through each product that I have and just learning and. And I love that piece of it where it can teach me how to do it and I don't have to wait to hire someone to do it. And I could do it myself. And my husband says it's, you know, the true mark of an entrepreneur. But whatever it is, I love it because I feel like I'm a superhero with AI, I can do anything. It really can teach me just about anything. And I learn very well.
[00:41:57] Speaker D: Yeah, you're smart girl. And Eleanor, I told you I would give you a chance to go through the next million things you're doing.
[00:42:03] Speaker F: Yeah. For us in marketing, AI is a very scary proposition that has to be taken very seriously. I too love AI, absolutely love it. And about a year and a half ago, we made a huge investment and built out our own software so that we could be ahead of this.
However, you know, there's still a lot of limitations. I sort of call it the wild, wild West.
And to just to be part of that and be, you know, present during this and being able to take it to the next level with really strong partners has been very, very life affirming for me.
[00:42:43] Speaker D: Real AI Use Cases Business Owners Roundtable Passage to Profit with Richard and Elizabeth Gearhart. We have two more entrepreneur interviews. You're going to want to hear these ladies. It's amazing. We'll be right back.
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[00:44:54] Speaker A: Passage to profit continues with Richard and Elizabeth Gearhart. Quick shout out to our friends at KPSE 1450am and 107.1 FM in Erie, PA. Thanks for listening. And if you're new here, Passage to Profit is a top ranked entrepreneurial podcast and radio show heard in 38 markets. It's a place where founders share what really works. Now this is the Intellectual Property News podcast with Richard Gerhardt.
[00:45:22] Speaker D: Who owns your clone.
[00:45:24] Speaker A: Well, the answer may surprise you. And we're not just talking about biological clones like Dolly the sheep. You remember, she was cloned a long time ago. We're talking about AI clones. And AI clones are becoming a thing. With an AI clone, you can appear in videos without being on camera. You can host live streams. You can set up customer interactions. They can create content.
They can do all sorts of things.
[00:45:50] Speaker D: Do you own your clone or does the program that you did it with own it?
[00:45:54] Speaker A: Well, that's a great question, and it's an emerging legal question. Nobody really knows all the answers yet, but one thing for sure is you do own your likeness. You own your face, the way you look.
You own your mannerisms. You own what you say. You know, you own your Persona. But when it comes to creating a clone, it gets a little bit more difficult. So most of the platforms that create human clones from AI have models that they use, and they claim ownership of the model, and they usually want to own the content, too.
So they own what you say and what you look like, and you pay for the privilege of having your clone. And then if it turns out that they don't like you or you want to move on to a different company, usually they want to keep the clone.
And they can use that for training, they can use that for creating other clones, and if you're not careful, they can even use your personality and likeness as a clone for their own purposes.
[00:46:55] Speaker D: So what if they go bankrupt?
[00:46:58] Speaker A: Well, then, you know, that's probably most of the AI clone companies at this point. There's nothing really there that addresses that issue. You'd have to try to get the asset somehow, I guess.
[00:47:10] Speaker D: So if I use a company to make my clone, what are the most harmful and unauthorized uses they can do with it?
[00:47:16] Speaker A: Well, I mean, the big issue right now with clones is deep fakes, right? And everybody's concerned about somebody getting access to their AI clone and using it improperly. I mean, even now, AI is just all over the place. AI generated videos are all over the place. You can't even tell what's real and what's not.
[00:47:34] Speaker D: So if someone has your clone, can they use it for. For identity theft?
[00:47:38] Speaker A: They could, absolutely. It's a real issue, and I think there's a lot of issues that need to be worked out. On the legal side, society also has to make some decisions about how all of this is going to work. And still the wild west out there. So proceed with cloning yourself at your own risk.
[00:47:57] Speaker D: So if you purchase software or license software to make a clone of yourself, is there any way to protect yourself? Can you get them to change their terms or anything?
[00:48:06] Speaker A: Well, maybe if you're like Brad Pitt, you can do it, but if you're just an ordinary person, it may be an uphill battle. They have those terms and conditions because they want to have ownership and they want to protect their business models. They want to be able to use that information for training, other things. So if you have an idea or invention, you want to protect the team at. Gearhart Law helps entrepreneurs turn ideas into protected assets. You can Visit us at learnmoreaboutpadants.com or learn more about Trademarks.com for a free consultation and practical guides to get you started.
Now it's time for our entrepreneur interviews. Elizabeth, take it away.
[00:48:48] Speaker D: Okay, so first on board is Eleanor Kubacki. She is a marketing genius. Her website blew me away. It's efkgroup.com Eleanor, tell us what you're doing in this brand new AI world that is above and beyond anything I've seen before.
[00:49:03] Speaker F: Yeah, for us it is an absolute culture and strategy change. I've had my agency for 28 years and there's been many different iterations of that agency. And that's why we've made it all these years and grown. But this time is very, very, very different. This is really stripping it all down, forgetting everything we have known and building it back up, which is a really amazing opportunity to live through. And I, like you, was talking about believing and betting on yourself. And I said to myself, I'm going to change everything I've ever done and I'm going to do everything I've ever done very differently. And that was really hard to give up that level of security. And you know, I've had success and I followed a strategy that has worked consistently through the years. And to allow that to go to the wayside and then to bring a whole company with you on what your ideas are things, that has truly been a very different game for me. And it started about a year and a half ago when I decided I wasn't gonna fight it and decided that I was gonna get on top of it, get ahead of it. And that started with releasing an RFP to work with companies to help build a software.
[00:50:19] Speaker D: What's an rfp?
[00:50:20] Speaker F: That's a request for proposal.
[00:50:22] Speaker D: Okay.
[00:50:22] Speaker F: And in my world, everything you do is done through an rfp. And this is an opportunity for companies to show you how they can build software, help you launch a product, to build marketing campaigns, so on and so forth. So that's a mechanism that allows companies to work together.
Released an RFP and came up with what I think is the next iteration of how AI should work with brands and marketing agencies to facilitate better results, roi, return on investment for our clients. That is based in using AI more in the sense of media, spend more in the sense of strategy versus creative or copy, which it isn't there yet.
And so we launched that software about two months ago. We're right now working with the state of New Jersey. And you know, we're in market, we work with universities and just getting them in that headspace. So for us it has been a complete game changer. And I really believe, at the end of the day is that if you're not willing to commit, then I think there's gonna be a lot of people who aren't here in a year from now, and that's the hard part.
[00:51:35] Speaker A: Speaking a little bit more generally, you know, there's a lot going on in the digital revolution. There's a lot going on in the AI space.
Do you have any thoughts about how people can maintain a healthy balance when it comes to these topics? You know, you can get so saturated. We were talking earlier in the program about just going down the AI rabbit hole, for example, and you wonder, okay, how healthy is that for us if we become so obsessed with technology or so obsessed with social media? You have any thoughts about how to maintain a balance between being engaged in that and also, you know, living in a good, healthy life?
[00:52:13] Speaker F: Yeah, it's actually a great question. When I brought AI to the company, to the leadership team a year ago, I had a lot of resistance. Now, what I have seen in the last year is the total opposite, where people not only have embraced it, but are really relying on it. And so, honestly, there needs to be a balance for businesses to figure out what it does well and what it does not do well and how to harness the things that it does well. And for me, that's all about software integration.
Partnerships are the name of the game. I think in order for businesses, marketing agencies, brands to do really well, it's about rethinking how we do business. And I think it's business built from the ground up and honestly, getting great partners. I work with Salesforce, believe it or not, they are one of our partners. And what's interesting is that nobody has a chokehold on it yet. When I tell you every week we have informational sessions with these partners to figure out what's next or how this software is going to work in market.
Everybody is just figuring it out. So there's a lot of opportunities for businesses here.
[00:53:21] Speaker D: It's so funny because you said it was hard to get the heads of the businesses. So Richard and I do. I do the marketing, but we do it together. So we were the first ones to introduce AI to Gearhart Law through the marketing. So the head of the company was the first. One of the first ones.
[00:53:36] Speaker F: Yeah.
[00:53:37] Speaker D: And bringing everybody else on board has been really tough for us. And now Richard is really pushing making the law firm an AI augmented firm.
[00:53:45] Speaker A: You see little converts along the way, people who are initially resistant. It sounds scarier than it really is.
And if you try it and you work with it, you do appreciate that there is still a fair amount of thinking that has to go into using this tool, it's not going to replace humans yet. Who knows what the future holds? And I'll see people kind of light up a little bit and say, oh, I used AI for this, whereas before they were like, I'm not touching the stuff.
[00:54:10] Speaker D: But we will not use a marketing agency that's not up to date on AI and so I don't expect it to replace them. We still need the people. Like, we have questions and AI gets it wrong, it lies. It's all this other stuff.
[00:54:22] Speaker F: Yeah, right.
[00:54:23] Speaker D: So we do need people at the marketing agency that we can interact with, but they better be using cutting edge techniques. Right. Because we want to stay above the fold.
Say in the old days of the newspaper. Right. You might be above the fold.
[00:54:37] Speaker A: So, Matt, what do you think about all of this? Do you have any comments or questions for Eleanor?
[00:54:41] Speaker C: Well, first of all, if you had to frame out what the key strategic challenges of your business are, you probably don't go, you know, I need the right AI solution. AI is a tool to help you advance your strategic challenges and goals.
It's part of the toolkit where, where it fits within your toolkit, I think, is dependent upon the resources of your company, the space that you're in and the time that you're willing to put in and who you could allocate to it. I think you need subject matter experts who do this on behalf of the company, who take the lead in this, because we're not all blessed with the same skill and natural comfort level. You said it before, people had this obvious discomfort in your firm and then they tested it and they're like, okay, I see it, but not everybody is going to adapt really quickly to this. And they need other folks to evangelize on behalf of the company and then share it and spread the use cases. Yeah.
[00:55:38] Speaker A: I mean, in the legal business, drafting documents is what attorneys spend most of their time doing. And if you look at AI, it drafts all sorts of stuff for you, may not always be right for the legal stuff, but it's doing it. And people are saying, well, you going to need me if you've got a computer that does all of this and it's a legitimate question.
[00:55:56] Speaker D: You do so, Eleanor, Because I mean, we're doing copy for this. Like, I gave us questions and I'm like, I can do better questions than this myself.
[00:56:04] Speaker F: Right.
[00:56:04] Speaker D: So what parts are you using it for? I know you and I were talking before the show about all the back end stuff you do with AI that people don't even know about. Right. Is that where you're implementing first?
[00:56:15] Speaker F: Yeah. So for us, one thing that we have found is that for us, it's our first pass. I think that's the best way to sort of put this in terms that'll make sense for us. How can we increase our productivity by 30%? That was our goal this year. Right. And so that meant sitting down with creatives, a creative director, a brilliant creative director, and saying, listen, first pass on creative is now via you and AI, your AI tool of choice. Right. And that was a very scary proposition. People are very, very nervous. I said at that point is, is that AI can not get you there, but what it can do is reduce the minutia, it can reduce the meaningless work, it can make you more productive. And that is the truth. It doesn't take away, it adds to your productivity. So for us, it was a numbers game and we just got there because you have to build confidence in how you are driving your business with AI and not leaving staff behind. So there's a fine balance there.
[00:57:19] Speaker A: So, Eleanor, do you think that you would eventually reduce your team, the size of your team, if AI tools take over? I mean, having a responsibility to your company, or are you just going to kind of, hopefully you grow fast enough that you won't have to face that decision.
[00:57:38] Speaker F: Right, so that's exactly right. So that's why we have completely done a retool. I grew up in a union family. Like, I was just thinking today, you know, kids, like, don't understand. You never cross a picket line. That's how I grew up. Right. I have a socially responsible company that's in our DNA. So, no, my whole goal, it's funny, I just sat down with one of our creative directors and I said, no one's going to get left behind. That's my number one goal. That's my job, is that no one gets left behind.
So what I have to do is figure out how I will increase our revenue. And for me, it's all media driven, it's behavioral driven online. We can make our clients much more successful. And if I can get ahead of it and be that agency that does it, I look that at continued growth. So that's my strategy.
[00:58:27] Speaker D: Working in this day and age. Right now, the way you do that is with the human touch, like, right, you have to be trusted.
[00:58:34] Speaker G: Right.
[00:58:35] Speaker D: Authentic.
[00:58:36] Speaker A: I mean, do you ever worry that because of AI that people aren't going to learn the skills that they need in order to make good judgments about AI output? So one of the things that we, you know, we have interns, we ask them for do help on projects, they go right to AI, they get the answer. And then I say, I say, well, did you learn anything when you did that? Right. So are you accumulating the skills and the real world knowledge to be able to evaluate these things?
[00:59:06] Speaker F: Right. I mean that's a really, there's going to be so many challenges that we are faced with and I think that's a huge one. But I think to your point earlier, is that, you know, adapting multiple tools, AI tools will keep us at our best. Because they say, and I do believe this is that the people that are going to succeed during this new revolution are people who can operate AI to the best of their ability. So they're sort of on the right track.
[00:59:34] Speaker C: So I heard, and I had said goals and strategy, I heard grow revenue, improve our productivity by 30% and create client services that enhance their outcomes. Right. And then the question is, in what ways can we utilize AI to advance these strategies to accomplish those goals? Right. So, so I think where you started, that's the thing. Like it's not just like, hey, I'm just going to get in there and scratch around in AI, what are the core challenges of your business? Where do you want to get to, what's the plan to get there? And in what way can you utilize AI as a tool and in the overall toolkit?
[01:00:17] Speaker A: So somebody has to set the goals
[01:00:19] Speaker C: and have the vision it comes from typically the leadership.
Sometimes it's a strategist, sometimes the CEO or the person who runs the company is the chief strategist. But I think if it's not woven in specificity around what do you want it to ultimately do for your business, you can sort of go so deep into it and not have clarity around what you're trying to get out of it.
[01:00:45] Speaker D: When I'm going to do a new podcast, I do chatgpt, do a business plan, but everything like that that you do has to have an outcome, desired outcome at the end. Right. And for you, you can use AI, but you, you know that one of your outcomes is this authenticity and trust. So you have to weave those two together. And how do you weave what you get from AI in with having people look human enough that because AI doesn't like you if you don't look human, right?
[01:01:10] Speaker C: Yeah. Well, that should be part of the fabric of your service based business. If I'm hiring your firm and I feel like all it is, I'm getting bot related stuff, I'm not going to use their firm, I want that human experience to be front and center. And then I don't care if there was some utilization of it. But if you step back for a second, and I wrote about this in the book Vision.
What's the vision for your business? Where do you see it in 5 years or 10 years?
What are the goals? How do you benchmark it in specificity? What's the strategy and plan to get there? What tactics do you use and how do you iterate on those tactics? That's basic 101 business building.
And where does AI fit in? That it's in. It's in the tactics to accomplish those goals.
[01:02:01] Speaker D: So what is your vision, Eleanor? Exactly right.
[01:02:03] Speaker F: Yeah. For us it is understanding and being on the forefront of how AI will help businesses succeed in this new environment. And I mean new environment and in marketing in every which way but loose. And so for us, if the. I think one of the reasons that EFK and myself have been successful is because my client's success is the most important thing to me besides my employees. So if I balance out those things and go with good intent and give it everything I have, I believe at the end of the day that we're going to end up on top with the AI revolution, honestly. And. And I just keep on every day, like you said, I wake up and I'm all in. And for me, it's a little exciting, to be honest with you, because it's new. I've been doing the same thing for 30 years. So let's shake it up and let's figure out how to stay on top of it and grow and that's exciting.
[01:03:00] Speaker D: Eleanor Kabacki, efkgroup.com and then you also have Good Behavior brand Duck Clothing brand. Yes, we didn't get to that this time. Maybe next time.
[01:03:08] Speaker G: All right.
[01:03:09] Speaker F: That would be amazing.
[01:03:10] Speaker A: Passage to Profit with Richard and Elizabeth Gerhardt.
[01:03:13] Speaker D: Now she has been waiting patiently. Antonia Tamayo with Antonia's Promise, a story of love and hope and healing. I love Antonia's story and I love that she is spreading the word through this amazing promise products she invented. Antonia, go.
[01:03:29] Speaker G: I love you guys. So Antonia's Promise is a true story of healing and miracles through the intercession of the Virgin Mary of to her son Jesus Christ made a promise to God on 2:10 that if he had helped me with something that I was struggling with that I would spread love and light as a vessel for him. On 211 I received my miracle which was the Day of Lady of Lord's Day of the Sick. So I keep my promise as God has always kept his.
And I created merch candles and diaries and things of that nature. From there, sneakers that I'm wearing today.
And then from there, I just launched my jewelry line with Antonia's promise of the broken praying cross as a reminder that you are never alone and that God is always with you. And my slogan is, we are all broken. And Richard is my attorney.
He has all my patents and trademarks.
[01:04:24] Speaker A: So go into a little bit more detail about this license deal that you got, right? Because we started talking about this a while ago.
[01:04:30] Speaker G: This has been such a journey. And I want to go back eight years ago when I. You know, when this all happened in 2018. I think I was one of your first guests when you guys first started, right? And all I had was a story.
That's all I had was a story. And then from there, I created this design, and now it's become bigger than me because I just kept going and going and going, and it was bigger than me, right? This was inside of me. It was bigger than me. It wouldn't let up. It was 24 hours a day. I just couldn't stop doing it, thinking of it revolving. But thankfully, God had opened so many doors, right? Because it takes a village. It just. It just does. It takes a village of people. And. And I was very grateful to have met the Gearharts. And from there, I had hired a consultant, right, that had helped me and guided me, and from there, I had other people to help me along. When you had introduced me to podcasting, I was like, oh, my God, me, right? And then I said, okay, maybe this is something that'll work, because I do love radio, and I love coming to passing profit, too. And I like to talk and meet people.
[01:05:36] Speaker A: We notice that, right?
[01:05:37] Speaker G: So I'm like, this is gonna work. So when I. When that happened, someone had said, when are you coming out with. Well, I was always asked, when am I going to come out with the new jewelry line?
And I had been working with this jeweler to make certain designs for me for gifts and so on and so forth. And I had left the show, and I had taped here, and we had put it together. Me and Elizabeth Wright had worked on it, and it looks so beautiful. And I went back to the jeweler, and I said, hey, people want this stuff. They want my cross. We got. We got to make this. And he goes, okay. And I go, okay. And he goes, yeah, okay. And I think it took us about two years from start to finish, but I just landed my agreement with him, and you guys have it. And that's how it happened. I mean, that's it in a nutshell.
[01:06:25] Speaker D: Well, wait a minute, Antonia. You left out something super important.
[01:06:28] Speaker G: What did I leave out?
[01:06:29] Speaker D: Do you have any patents?
[01:06:30] Speaker G: Yes, I do.
[01:06:33] Speaker D: Do you have a patent in Italy?
[01:06:34] Speaker G: I do. So?
So the Broken Praying Cross is patented in the USA and in Italy. And there is a bead that I put on a pink bead on everything that I make as a symbol of the rosary that was given to me when I was once broken and in church. And that pink bead is patented in Italy as well.
[01:06:54] Speaker A: And so are the patents part of your license agreement?
[01:06:57] Speaker G: Yes, actually, they are. They're all in there.
[01:07:00] Speaker A: So the thing is, is that if you want to do a deal, if you have a consumer product or really any technology, you need some asset to convey. And so sometimes it's manufacturing, sometimes it's a transfer of rights. But in any case, intellectual property plays a role in the commercial process. And so we definitely are happy that things are working out so well for you. You know, you've been through a lot of challenges, a lot of medical challenges in your life, and, you know, without getting into too much detail, can you talk to us about healing?
What is the process of healing like for you? Do you feel like you've sort of emotionally recovered from some of these physical challenges that you faced earlier on?
[01:07:47] Speaker G: I've recovered from everything. And the only reason why is because I have my faith that has healed me. Without my faith, I have nothing. And that's the truth. It strengthens me. It heals me. It gives me purpose. I am in love with Antonia's promise, and. And I love that I get to share this message and help others through my story, and that heals me.
[01:08:10] Speaker D: Yeah. Antonia, I remember a few years ago, though, there was a time when you wanted to stop.
[01:08:17] Speaker G: Yes. Because it was overwhelmingly exhausting. And finances, like Matt said. Right. Cash is king. Right. And that was a big issue. And I felt very stale and tired, and I didn't know where to turn. And then ideas just kept coming and coming and coming, and I'm like, okay, but how am I going to do that? And I met the right people again, and God had opened more doors. And I always say, if God opens a door, I'm going to walk through them. And I do, you know, how did I get here today? Only God knows how, but I have the grit, like Matt does and Eleanor does, to keep going and fighting and doing and not give up.
And I think that's how we all get here.
[01:08:56] Speaker D: Matt, do you have a comment or question.
[01:08:58] Speaker C: Yeah. You know, I think the spirituality guides you, and it's so profound because when you sort of have that and not everyone has that at your level, such a blessing. Right.
Because everything that you do in business when you're an entrepreneur ultimately comes back on you and that you. That resilience, man. So if you feel that you have that resilience and then you have that sense of purpose for what you're doing and you feel like there's a higher power, I mean, gosh, yeah, that's a wonderful blend.
[01:09:31] Speaker A: Yeah.
[01:09:31] Speaker D: And I'm glad she didn't give up.
[01:09:33] Speaker C: No, I agree. And. And I would say that it is also a curse having this sort of what we have. You know, Kenny, Kenny asked a question when we were doing a Talk at the 92nd Street. Why all these people want to start something. What do you tell them? I said, I tell them almost 95% not to do it.
Because if you can't just lay there in the middle of the night and go, no matter what I'm doing this, then you shouldn't do it. There's almost an irrationality to entrepreneurship.
[01:10:07] Speaker A: Part of it is staying in the game.
[01:10:09] Speaker G: You know, I'm not allowed to give up. I'm not allowed. It just doesn't exist. It's bigger than me.
[01:10:15] Speaker C: But to that point, we also do have to show some grace.
I'm going to be 65 in May. And I mentioned this, I mentioned earlier. Yeah. Because so this book has taken me, that I wrote, took me through mid age, midlife, and I shared my journey and the goal was to ultimately live a long, healthy life, as I mentioned earlier. And I share everything I overcame, but I also wanted to be very clear about what is the process of aging going to open up for me in terms of new ways and how do I embrace it? Because we look at our aging lives as a declining thing.
And so you know what? I had to step away, hire a CEO, spend more time doing other things like traveling to the Amalfi coast and, you know, and doing things that you don't get to do when you're 25, 35, 45, 50, killing it every day with more demands than you have time. So the one thing I would say inevitably is, you know, we also all need that end game too, like as we go further down the road in our personal life, planning. And how does your work change as you get older? And how do you continue to transcend a happy and healthy life? It's something I'm very mindful of yeah.
[01:11:32] Speaker D: Well, I think for Richard and me, we love what we're doing. I don't think we'll ever retire.
I don't think anybody here will.
[01:11:39] Speaker F: No.
[01:11:40] Speaker G: No.
[01:11:40] Speaker C: So I have now made sure, though, that I'm traveling overseas twice a year. That was a definitive goal because I raised a boy with severe autism. We could not ever let up. He's cared for. He's in a group home. He's solid.
So if I don't do It now, in 15 years, I'm going to have those regrets.
So there's certain things that were highly prioritized for me that only bubbled up when I had my financial house in order, my son's sort of care, and I stared myself in the mirror and said, do I want to work 80 hours a week? I don't.
I want to work 25 to 30 really solid. But again, I've earned that. I've earned the right to make that decision. May not be right for everyone. You all may want to work 80. I love that about you.
I. In fact, I'm sort of like.
I don't know how people do it, like, at a certain level, the way I did it and keep going. I feel burnout inevitably, and I don't want to be that guy.
[01:12:46] Speaker D: Yeah.
[01:12:47] Speaker A: Antonio, what do you see for your future? What are you looking for?
[01:12:50] Speaker G: I'm ready to go. I'm so ready to go.
[01:12:53] Speaker D: Do you have product?
[01:12:54] Speaker G: I'm the opposite of Matt. Like, I'm gonna be 50 next month. And I'm like, it starts now.
[01:13:00] Speaker D: Spring chicken.
[01:13:00] Speaker G: I can't wait. And I have the next 15 years, and I think I'll die down when I'm 65. But I. I've built this. I'm ready. I have the podcast, I have the jewelry. I have the clothing. I have the sne. Like, I'm excited, you know, I. I want to go.
[01:13:15] Speaker A: Yeah.
[01:13:16] Speaker G: I don't want to be held back anymore.
[01:13:17] Speaker C: When I had a thought, you know, 150 years ago, the average lifespan was 38. It's not that long ago. It's three and a half generations ago.
Today we live in 80. If you don't get cancer or heart disease, you could easily live to 90.
So we really didn't have a midlife up until maybe a generation ago.
So I kind of looked at the stages of my life now. Like, I've been through this. I could live a long, joyful life with meaningful projects, but work not be the only thing I do, which I've been doing for 40 years. Since I'm 22, 23.
[01:13:52] Speaker A: Antonia. I feel the same way. I mean, I feel like I get excited about what I'm doing.
[01:13:57] Speaker G: It's fun.
I have fun. I like to have fun. And Antonia's Promise is fun. You know, I do, I enjoy it.
[01:14:06] Speaker D: Antonia Tamayo. I just, I do have to ask you, you have struggled to get your product produced and ready to sell and ship out to people. Do you have product now? Do you have the crosses to sell?
[01:14:15] Speaker G: Absolutely. Yeah, absolutely.
[01:14:17] Speaker F: Where do people come from?
[01:14:18] Speaker G: I'm wearing one today. Where do they get one? Go to antoniaspromise.com for the broken praying cross.
I have them in large gold and silver and rose gold and in smaller sizes. And there's some really great stuffs coming out. But they are custom made, one of a kind. You'll never see them on anyone else because they're my patent designs. And there'll be more really good stuff coming out. I'm excited.
[01:14:42] Speaker A: And, and where can they find it? You have a website or.
[01:14:45] Speaker G: I do. Antoniaspromise.com Yep. Or follow me on Antonia's Promise. LinkedIn, Antonia's Promise. Instagram, Antonia's Promise, Facebook, all under Antonia's Promise.
[01:14:56] Speaker D: Don't go away, because secrets of the entrepreneurial mind is coming. Richard and Elizabeth Gehart with Passage to Profit. We'll be right back.
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[01:16:02] Speaker A: It's passage to Profit. Alicia Morrissey is our programming director at Passage to Profit and she's also a fantastic jazz vocalist. You can scroll to the bottom of the passage to profitshow.com website and check out her album.
[01:16:18] Speaker D: Now it is time for Secrets of the Entrepreneurial Mind. I'm gonna start with Matt Ross. Matt, what is a secret you can share with our listeners?
[01:16:26] Speaker C: I wrote in my book this theme called what's yous Magic? And it's a chapter. What's yout Magic? Was really defined in two ways. What are you best at? What do you love to do the most?
And if you could spend the bulk of your time in those boxes and delegate everything else.
I'm really good at building team and finding talent and cultivating them because I need them.
There's a lot of things I really stink at, and I'm uber self aware and cool with it. I'm really cool with saying I'm not good. So I think the key is understanding what you're best at, what you love to do. Find that lane. Build a team to complement your skills and give them the room and let them go and guide them and coach them.
[01:17:13] Speaker D: Excellent. Eleanor Kubaki, what's the secret you can share?
[01:17:17] Speaker F: For us, our company mantra lately is get comfortable being uncomfortable.
Right. And for us, at the end of the day, it's something that I lead with on a weekly basis, and that comes from my heart because I've had to be very uncomfortable a lot. I've had to make decisions that really scare me and really looking fear and understanding that that too shall pass. And that usually takes you to exactly where you need to be.
[01:17:45] Speaker D: Excellent. Thank you. Antonia Tameo, what's a secret you can share?
[01:17:49] Speaker G: I love to create, create, create, create. Whether it's designing clothing or jewelry or making a bracelet, inspiring people, that's my goal and that's what I truly, truly love to do.
[01:18:02] Speaker D: Thank you. Richard Gearhart. What's the secret you can share?
[01:18:05] Speaker A: Don't flip out.
We've been going through these negotiations for acquiring this firm, and I sent the guy what I thought was a very reasonable offer. He came back with something that was just totally unreasonable. And my first reaction was to go tell him suck a rock. But.
And I was like, I had my hands on the keyboard and I was like, you got to be crazy, man. And I took a step back and I just said, well, I'm going to answer him tomorrow. If I want to tell him to suck a rock, I can tell him tomorrow. I slept on it for a while, and then I started thinking strategically about it. I started thinking, well, you know, maybe there's a way that we can pick this apart and maybe I can find a response and a way to respond so that we can kind of keep the deal going and maybe there are some possibilities here. And so I did that. I took a few steps back, I looked at it and said, well, what can I give on? Where do I need to stand firm? And I came up with a response and I gave them reasons for why this is happening.
And he backed off most of his stuff, and we're still talking about it. So if I had flipped out, it would have been done and gone.
[01:19:18] Speaker D: Well, my secret is going to be don't forget to look at your data or have someone look at it. So we were in our marketing meeting and our marketing assistant was like, this data just doesn't add up. You're getting all these leads, but the clients aren't coming through.
And so I was like, what the heck? Let's look at this. And we have somebody implementing AI in different parts of our company and the law firm. And I think he did something that screwed up one of our automations.
But now we've got a fix in place. So you have to look at your data or have somebody look at your data, like, all the time to find these kind of things.
[01:19:54] Speaker A: That's it for today's Passage to Profit show. If you enjoyed this episode, subscribe to the podcast and leave a quick review. Also, follow us on Facebook, Instagram, TikTok and X and subscribe to our YouTube channel for bonus content.
Tune in next week for another episode of Passage to Prophet.
